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Vancouver's Number 1 Skeptical Podcast and Radio Show

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Show Notes for Episode 154

Posted by Ethan Clow on February 22, 2012

Radio Freethinker Episode 154 – C-30 and Vic Toews, CAM in Oz, Vatican loses Tax-Exempt status, and Legislating Morality?

Download the Episode Here!

Skeptical News:

C-30 and Vic Toews

  • http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/category/full-comment/
  • http://www.ottawacitizen.com/technology/Toews+Twitter+persecutor+traced+House+Commons/6165678/story.html

Australian Universities Defend Alternative-Medicine Teaching

Vatican loses Tax-Exempt status on commercial property

  • http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17072211

Topics:

Legislating Morality

Skeptical Highlights:

Brother Guy Consolmagno

H.R. MacMillan Space Centre

Feb. 25, 2012, 7:30 pm

The Vatican astronomer and planetary scientist lectures on how science and religion handle changes in our understanding of reality

http://stmarkscollege.ca/townlecture/.

The third annual Cross Canada Skeptical Smackdown Wednesday, March 14, 2012 at 7:30pm
What is the Cross Canada Skeptical Smackdown?
It’s fun and challenging! But more specifically it is a British-style pub-quiz focussing on critical thinking and scientific topics. It occurs every year in multiple locations across Canada with local and national bragging rights at stake. It’s happening at the Billy Bishop Legion in Vancouver.

Facebook Event here

Posted in Blogs, Show notes | 3 Comments »

History Fail: US Marines Pose with Nazi SS Flag

Posted by Ethan Clow on February 12, 2012

There are some news stories I never expect to see. One of them is “US Marines caught posing with Nazi SS flag.”

But apparently I should learn to expect the unexpected. CNN featured this story of how a elite squad of US Marines created controversy by posing with an American flag next to, what appeared to be a the symbol of the Nazi Schutzstaffel, also known as the special guards of the Nazi elite, as well as the personal army of Heinrich Himmler and were responsible for millions of war crime atrocities during the Holocaust.

The public relations branch of the military went into damage control once the image began circulating the internet on Friday, of course the photo had been taken a few years ago and was only now seeing the light of day. According to CNN, the Marine Corps Scout Snipers from the 1st Reconnaissance Battalion, who are featured in the photo, which was taken in 2010 in Afghanistan and the photo’s description says the “SS” flag had been “adopted and used by the Marines in reference to Scout Sniper.”

To quote the article (damnphasis mine) (( on the advice of my friend Yves I’ve changed the word emphasis to damnphasis))

“The Marine Corps said it became aware of the photo last November and the local command investigated, but found it not to be racially motivated, according to a statement released by a Marine Corps spokesman, Lt. Col. Stewart Upton.

The unit’s commander decided not to proceed with disciplinary action, it said, but all Marines in the unit were reminded that such behavior will not be tolerated and any further display could result in punishment.

“They determined that the Marines in the photo were ignorant of the connection of this symbol to the Holocaust and monumental atrocities associated with Nazi Germany,” Amos said in his statement Friday.”

I’d like to draw attention to some of that quote. The investigation claims the use of the symbol was found to not be racially motivated. Let’s just think about that for a moment, this sniper squad choose to use the abbreviation ‘SS’ and chose the exact same logo the Nazi Schutzstaffel squad used… This is like burning a cross that stands for “time to go.”

Even if we assume that the marines in question were totally ignorant of who the SS were or what they did, what are the odds they would pick the exact same logo and say not bother to do a quick Wikipedia search to make sure, oh I don’t know, the SS weren’t a genocidal murder squad?

Perhaps the marines wanted to be badasses or something. Perhaps they felt using the SS name was justified because the SS were feared and they thought they could latch on to that emotional impact. But that leads us into the next part of the quote I highlighted. They claimed to be ignorant of the SS and their Holocaust crimes against humanity. So these marines may only be stupid and lazy and not neo-Nazis. Wonderful.

What is also telling is that previously in the article the word ‘adopted’ is used to describe the usage of the symbol and term ‘SS.’ To me, this would imply that marines clearly knew the context of the word and logo.

Not to mention, are we really going to believe that bunch of marines, who are probably military buffs, don’t know about the largest conflict of the 20th century? Did any of them never seen Schindler’s List or one of the other famous movies about the Holocaust??

At least it appears the military is doing its job to make sure that soldiers recognize that using Nazi imagery is probably a bad thing.

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Show notes for Episode 152

Posted by Ethan Clow on February 9, 2012

Radio Freethinker Episode 152 – Mystery Atheist in Vancouver, Is gender selection wrong? Secrets of Mona Lisa revealed? Men Try to impress Women and Canadian Imams issue fatwa against honor killings

Download the Episode here!

Skeptical News:

Topics:

Canadian imams issue fatwa against honor killings

Skeptical Highlights:

Richard Heinberg Opening Lecture

Theatre 5 (Room A130) Langara College

Friday February 10th  5 – 7 pm

Richard Heinberg is one of the world’s most effective exponents of the urgent need to move away from fossil fuels and towards a post-growth economy. Author of 10 books, including 2010′s The End of Growth, his wry, unflinching approach addresses challenges such as climate change, peak oil, economic instability, and food insecurity.

http://www.codev.org/film-festival/richard-heinberg-opening-lecture/

Gwynne Dyer: The New Middle East

February 8, 2012 | 7-9 PM

Djavad Mowafaghian Cinema SFU downtown, 149 West Hastings Street.

Tickets $10

Non-violent democratic revolutions are sweeping through the Arab World, until now one of the last strongholds of tyranny and poverty. They are a great advance for liberty, but they don’t solve the problem of poverty – and they may open the door to power to Islamist movements.

There are fears oil embargo, which did not happen after the Iranian revolution; fears of Al quida terrorism, which is unlikely as these revolutions are a massive, probably decisive popular rejection of the violent, extremist ideology known as “Islamism”.  Al-Qaeda and its Islamist allies have been trying to trigger revolutions against the existing Arab regimes for three decades, with absolutely no success. Now the revolutions are happening, but with no Islamist involvement whatever.

If people choose to elect Islamic (NOT Islamist) parties to power afterwards, that is no cause for panic. We should be no more frightened of Muslim Democratic parties (like the none that has won three successive elections and governed Turkey for the past ten years) than we are of Christian Democratic parties.

These new democracies may start representing the views and opinions of their people and not be parrots of American foreign policy which will put pressure on Israel to deal effectively with Palestine.

This shift in Arab strategy, though it does not involve military action, would be a long-term existential threat to the current Jewish state of Israel. These revolutions, by removing regimes that conformed to American policy rather than the views of their own population, are revealing the reality of Israel’s strategic situation in the region. But they also create an opportunity, perhaps a last opportunity, for a realistic Israeli government to negotiate a “two-state solution” that could win the support of the new Arab regimes.

http://sfuwoodwards.ca/index.php/events/details/the-new-middle-east

African Americans For Humanism

The need for critical thinking skills and a humanistic outlook in our world is great. This is no less true in the Black community than in others. Many African Americans have been engulfed by religious irrationality, conned by self-serving “faith healers”, and swayed by dogmatic revisionist historians. Many others, however, have escaped the oppression of such delusions, and live happy and upstanding lives free of superstition. African Americans for Humanism (AAH) exists to bring these secular humanists together, to provide a forum for communication, and to facilitate coordinated action. In an irrational world, those who stand for reason must stand together.

Check out their new website at http://aahumanism.net/

 

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Saturday Stub: And Another Thing That Bugs Me…

Posted by Ethan Clow on February 4, 2012

While we’re on the subject.

The other day was waiting for a bus in Vancouver. It was a typical day, the sun was out, it was still cold but it was one of those brisk late winter days where the sun is shining and people were in a good mood. I was waiting for a bus and quietly trying to think of a more efficient bus system that I could give to Translink because this particular bus is/was always late.

Anyway, there I’m standing, watching the cars drive past and people walk about when I see this shiny little black car pull up next to the bus stop. I glance over and notice something curious on the side of the door. On the door it has a logo with the slogan “Stop Religious Violence”

Well, that got my attention!

I took a step towards it and that’s when the freaking bus decides to show up.

Quickly, since the bus is already pulling up, I pull out my phone and queue up the camera app and take a quick picture of the car, hoping there’s website or something to follow up on. However, I didn’t catch it. The bus had arrived and people were hustling on and I had no time to run over and chat with the driver of this awesome car.

I did snap this picture as I was getting on the bus. The top part reads “My Spiritual Leader Licks my Face” and below that is the slogan “Stop Religious Violence.com” The license plate reads “Evolv”

I was kicking myself because I really wanted to ask the driver about his car, I’m pretty sure that it wasn’t just some decoration he put on their but was actually some sort of advertising for either a website or organization. At least, I think it was. The web address StopReligiousViolence.com doesn’t seem to go anywhere. Perhaps the site hasn’t been created yet or it’s just temporarily down. I also found this comment thread on Reddit with a picture of the same car.

If anyone knows this fellow or his car give me a shout. I’d like to invite him to a skeptics in the pub one night.

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The Myth of Positive Thinking

Posted by Ethan Clow on February 4, 2012

Having a radio show is useful in that it gives me a soapbox to occasionally vent from when I encounter frustrating examples of magical thinking in my real life.  Recently I’ve run into some proponents of the positive thinking crowd. What is this “positive thinking” thing you ask? Well at the basic level, we’re talking about optimism. The view/attitude that things are and will get better, and that viewing the world in an optimistic way, means overlooking the negative bad things and focusing all that’s good and saying happy, determined and self confident.

What a bunch of assholes, eh?

No, I’m just kidding, that all sounds pretty good, what could be wrong with that? Well “positive thinking” has taken on a new meaning, with rather woo-woo tendencies.

People like Deepak Chopra, self help guru’s, and others have written libraries of books on how to “think positively” to change your life. One famous example is the book The Power of Positive Thinking by Norman Vincent Peale, a preacher/motivational speaker. Another famous example is the book “The Secret” by Rhonda Byrne.

Here’s a definition on “positive thinking” similar to the sort tone seen in these practitioners of self improvement:

“Positive thinking is a mental attitude that admits into the mind thoughts, words and images that are conductive to growth, expansion and success. It is a mental attitude that expects good and favorable results. A positive mind anticipates happiness, joy, health and a successful outcome of every situation and action. Whatever the mind expects, it finds.”

So what could be wrong with this?

The problem is that positive thinking, no matter what form it takes, won’t replace key component’s to success or even achieving, say, Sam Harris’s the good life.

  • -Luck (some people are lucky, they get a big break, they find a great job, they don’t get born in abject poverty…)
  • -Hard work (some people spend all their time working just to make enough to survive. Others spend virtually every hour of the day devoted to their work, whether that’s building a computer operating system, running a home business or making building a space shuttle.
  • -Help (very few people are self made. Most people have received help from someone in a better position at some point that allowed them to succeed later in life. Maybe your parents letting you stay rent free while you got your degree, or a mentor who gave you valuable advice, or a day care that took care of your kids while you worked two jobs to make ends meet.)

What positive thinking suggests, is that there is this law of attraction that one’s mental disposition attracts similar external circumstances and events. In other words, your mental intentions and attitudes draw people and things of like intention and attitude to yourself. On one level this is trivially true. We generally hang out with people who think like us and share our values and we avoid people who disagree with us on important matters and don’t share our values.

However I’m sure we all know a few people who are just miserable S.O.B’s who happen to be very successful. Steve Jobs for instance, he was generally considered to be a very accomplished man. However, he was well known for his horrible attitude to his employees and lack of personal skills.

When we look at the book The Power of Positive Thinking and consider some of the criticism of the theory – the book is full of anecdotes that are hard to substantiate. Almost all of the experts and many of the testimonials that Peale quotes as supporting his philosophy are unnamed, unknown and not directly sourced. Examples include a “famous psychologist,” a two-page letter from a “practicing physician,” another famous psychologist, a “prominent citizen of New York City,” and dozens, if not hundreds, more unverifiable quotations.

Even the very notion that “positive thinking” acts as some sort of magnet for wealth and success fails for we never get a single explanation of how this supposed mechanism actually works. Are we all secretly psychic? When we really examine what this theory is suggesting that would be one of the conclusions we could draw.

But okay, so really, why do we need to get all skeptical about this? Can’t we just let these people “think positively” No. Because this isn’t some innocent game where no one gets hurt.

Positive thinking provides people with the illusion of having control over their lives. All I need to do is change my attitude and intentions and I’ll attract money like a magnet (or lose weight or whatever else it is I want to achieve). If it doesn’t work, it’s your fault because you didn’t genuinely change your attitude and intentions. If this sounds familiar, it’s also what faith healers say about people who don’t get better, they didn’t believe enough.

Nonsense

Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying we humans have NO control over our lives and a person like Bill Gates is just pure lucky and the homeless person on the street is just pure unlucky… like I mentioned earlier, many different factors play a role in success or failure. Luck is a big component of that. I rather appreciate that about life. Luck makes me humble. I know that when I see a person who is not doing so well at life, perhaps they don’t have the money for food or enough for a bed each night, I know that the reason I’m here and not there, isn’t because I’m some kind of super star  and they are some kind of loser, I was lucky to be born in a middle class family in Canada.

Hard work does play a huge role. Yes, some people fail because they don’t work hard enough or don’t pull their weight. It happens. And there are many other factors, having the guidance to find success, having the intelligence to build it up and prosper because of it, like I said, many factors.

And I’m not denying the importance of being an optimist either. As we learned from Richard Wiseman in his book 59 Seconds and Quirkology, if you are an optimist, you don’t let failure get you down, you tend to see the world as a place of opportunity and not failure after failure.

But this is completely different from just assuming your mental state will draw success to you. And it also doesn’t go so far as to ignore the other elements that make up success, hard work, luck and intelligence.

If you want to succeed at something, draw up a plan of action. List what you want to achieve. List what you must do to achieve your goals in the order you must do them. Specify how you are going to measure success at each step along the way.

Don made a good point on the show, an optimist will create a positive attitude where success is expected, they get out there and look for that success. Positive thinking suggests that success will come looking for you, even if you’re sitting on a couch watching TV.

The danger with such a view of the world is that it invites a really horrible form of blame shifting that I mentioned earlier. If someone didn’t succeed it’s because they didn’t think positively enough. I believe this is a rather insidious way to think about someone. How could it be worse than saying someone didn’t work hard enough? You might ask. Consider a time when you didn’t work hard and failed, you knew there was a reason for that failure, you learned that your output has to be up to the challenge of whatever it is you are doing if you want to achieve your goals.

Someone could come along and say it was because you didn’t have a positive attitude, Hmm maybe that was it, you think. Now consider a time when you really busted your butt and worked hard and achieved something amazing. Now imagine someone comes along and writes off your hard work and reduces it to magical thinking that magnetically attracts success. All that effort that you put yourself through is reduced to some wishy washy hocus pocus.

Optimism is a great tool, but don’t forget, it isn’t the alpha and omega, only one item in your tool belt of success.

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Show notes for Episode 151

Posted by Ethan Clow on February 1, 2012

Radio Freethinker Episode 151 – Artificial cell walls, Scientology evolving, Vitamin woo, and the Pseudoscience of “positive thinking”

Download the episode here!

Skeptical News:

Artificial Cell Wall

Scientology Evolving?

Are those vitamins doing more harm than good?

Topics:

The Pseudoscience of “Positive Thinking”

Skeptical Highlights:

Nigerian Witch Hunter comes to America
If you are:
•In bondage , Having bad dreams, Under a witchcraft attack or oppression ,Possessed by mermaid spirits or other evil spirits, Barren and having frequent miscarriages, Experiencing an unsuccessful life of disappointment, Experiencing financial impotency with difficulties, Facing victimization and a lack of promotion,  Experiencing a stagnant life with failures???
…You need not wait for too long. Helen Ukpabio, a Nigerian evangelist, will be traveling to the United States in March where she will be preaching in Texas. Ukpabio has reversed the exportation of religious extreme is as she takes her witch-hunting tour of the USA. She is the result of Pentecostal mission to Africa, where missionaries eagerly exploit local myths to promote their own evangelical aim…regardless of the harm it may do to society or the unfortunate sacrificial lambs.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-mungai/americans-should-protest-_b_1191387.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/22/us/22beliefs.html

Darwin Day 2012 – To celebrate the life and scientific contributions of Charles Darwin Centre For Inquiry Okanagan and the UBCO Freethoughts are proud to present lectures both on Darwin in the historical context and present the evidence for his theory. They include “Darwin, Nature, and God” by James Hull, and “Almost like a whale: Darwin and the origin of whales” by Jessica Theodor. Coffee will be served, admission is free with donations graciously accepted. Sunday, February 12, 2012 at 1:00pm until 4:30pm. Facebook Event Here

Caustic Soda Cholera Edition featuring Jenna! – Toren, Kevin, Joe are joined by Almost Dr. Jenna to talk  about cholera. Death by vomit and diarrhea, cholera cots, mummies, and how procrastination led to the world’s first artificial vaccine!

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Star Wars: Men can be Fat but Not Women

Posted by Ethan Clow on January 31, 2012

Like a whole bunch of people, I recently started playing the new MMORPG (Massively multiplayer online role-playing game) Star Wars The Old Republic, the quasi-sequel to the Knights of the Old Republic games produced by the popular video game making company Bioware.

So far I’m enjoying the game, it captures a lot of the fun and exploration that I found in the stellar Knights of the Old Republic games. Players are able to literally make their own way through the Star Wars universe, choosing whether to be a dark side jerk or light side hero. Expectations were high for this particular game given that its competing directly with the current most popular game ever, World of Warcraft, as well as the added burden of following in the footsteps of Bioware’s other successful games like Mass Effect and Dragon Age.

You might be wondering what draws my skeptical eye to this topic. Mainly it’s Bioware’s odd perception of what constitutes being overweight.

Let me explain, at the start of the game you get to design your character, you pick the race, sex, and background of your character. No matter which race you pick you are given four body types to chose from, seen below.

Body Types 1 and 2

 

Body Types 3 and 4

As you can probably see, there are a few discrepancies here. The obvious question is why are the male body shapes allowed to be fat but the female ones aren’t? We have four general body shapes, one very skinny, one “normal” skinny, one “normal” large and one very large. At least that’s how it would look if you only looked at the male body types. When only looking at the female body types it appears to be go from very very skinny to “slightly normal sized” human being.

I’m not the first person to point this out of course, and of the many who have pointed this out, we are asking if Bioware is creating sexist body images? The question sounds awkward to me because it’s not like the female body types are weaker or less effective in the game, it’s that Bioware has apparently decided they don’t want any fat women in their universe.

And clearly it’s a issue with women because they seem to have no problem with fat men. In fact, while playing the game I’ve tried to keep track of how many different body types I’ve encountered. So far I’ve met a lot of NPC (non-playable characters) who have diverse body shapes, although they’ve all been male. Every female character so far has one of the four body types we’ve seen. Even when you encounter female characters of different races or ages, they all seem to have the hour-glass shape.

So, what are we to make of this? Has Bioware made a sexist and/or uncalled for judgement on women’s body types? Before gamers rush to their defence, this is the same company that was responsible for the groan inducing “butt shot” from another of my favourite games, Mass Effect 2

Yah, that one.

That butt belongs to one of the main characters, Miranda Lawson, a genetically engineered super agent, kind of like a female James Bond, I guess.

The controversy of the butt shot was sort of addressed by Mass Effect 2 project lead Casey Hudson in an interview here. It wasn’t a very good explanation though, basically saying how Miranda is supposed to be a femme fatale.

As far as I know, Bioware hasn’t commented on the “no fat” option for female characters in The Old Republic. That hasn’t stopped debate online though. A number of forums dedicated to the Old Republic have comment threads regarding this issue but mostly any attempt at serious discussion gets drowned in crude “no fat chicks” remarks.

I’m sure there would be a tendency to shrug this off as something silly and not to get worked up over. Who cares, it’s just a video game and who cares, it’s a Star Wars video game for goodness sake, shouldn’t we be raging against Grand Theft Auto or something? I guess one could make that argument. One could also argue that the Old Republic universe is meant to be made up of superhero’s. And in these worlds of superhero’s, everything is exaggerated. Men have broad shoulders and women have big boobs and they all look great in tight spandex outfits.

And yet, that doesn’t explain why there can be fat dudes but not fat chicks. In fact, it offers very little in the way of explaining this because in playing the game I’ve encountered a number of small wimpy looking male characters, lots of non-exaggerated characters who don’t look in place in a world of superhero’s.

I wouldn’t suggest that the Old Republic is at the top of the list of games that objectify women. In other ways the game is very good at giving female characters interesting personalities and strong story lines which is something we’ve come to expect from Bioware games. For the most part the female characters don’t just exist for men to gawk at, they actually have well thought out back stories and generally offer a lot to the game.

I personally hope that someone takes an opportunity to ask Bioware about this. It’s not like I would suggest we all boycott the game or something, but clearly someone must have realized while making the game “hey wait a second, why can’t you pick a overweight female character but you can make an overweight male character?” Surely this came up. I would just really like to hear what sort of justification Bioware has for this, or even whether they view this as problematic or a non-issue. At that point, I think I would have a better idea of the kind of people who are making these games.

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The Wakefield Case Continues

Posted by Ethan Clow on January 30, 2012

A couple weeks ago on the show I mentioned the latest developments regarding the disgraced Andrew Wakefield.

Wakefield is the doctor who first started suggestion that vaccinations, particularly the MMR vaccine was causing health risks, eventually suggesting that autism was a result of the vaccine. Wakefield’s original study which was published in the Lancet was retracted (although many skeptics would have liked to see it retracted a lot sooner) he was also officially disciplined for using fraudulent methods in his research, having serious conflict of interests involving deals with legal firms suing drug companies, as well as very serious charges that he abused his authority and exposed children to unethical testing.

The current bit of news is that Wakefield is now suing the editor-in-chief of the British Medical Journal, Fiona Godlee, for defamation. The lawsuit also names British investigative journalist Brian Deer, who has covered the controversy over the measles, mumps and rubella vaccine, which led to a drop in MMR vaccination rates to dangerous levels.

The case has been filed in a Texas court, which is where Wakefield currently operates his business.

This isn’t the first time Wakefield has sued Deer. He sued the journalist, along with Channel 4 and 20/20 productions, over a documentary on MMR in 2004, but later dropped the action and agreed to pay legal costs.

With regards to the case, the BMJ has issued the following statement:

“The BMJ is on notice that Andrew Wakefield has issued defamation proceedings, not in London as might be ordinarily expected as concerns a predominately English publication, but in Texas, USA, where he now lives.

“Following the findings of the British General Medical Council’s Fitness to Practice Panel and Mr Wakefield’s history of pursuing unfounded litigation, any action brought against the BMJ and Mr Deer in London would have been immediately vulnerable to being struck out as an abuse of process.”

“Despite the findings of the GMC’s Fitness to Practice Panel and his co-authors having publicly retracted the causation interpretation put forward by the Lancet Paper, it would appear from the Claim filed at court that Mr Wakefield still stands by the accuracy of the Lancet paper and his conclusion therein, thereby compounding his previously found misconduct.

“While we await formal service, unsurprisingly the BMJ and Mr Deer stand by the material published in the BMJ and their other statements and confirm that they have instructed lawyers to defend the claim vigorously.”

Why is Wakefield pursing such a move? He’s lost previous attempts to silence Deer and others who have rightly criticized his methods. We debated his motives, Wakefield might just be desperate enough to cast himself as the victim in all this, so it could be the last gasp to see his name in lights before he is confirmed as one of the worst pseudo-scientists of all time…oops, too late. The online medical journal Medscape has voted Wakefield the worst doctor of 2011.

I wonder actually if Wakefield wasn’t in some ways an inspiration for Jude Law’s character in the movie Contagion

Law plays a seedy alternative medicine proponent/journalist who lacks any real ethics and promotes conspiracy theories about vaccines.  I would actually recommend the movie as its pretty good in terms of getting the science right, of course it is a movie though so its primary purpose is to be entertaining but it manages to be a little educational too.

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Show notes for Episode 150

Posted by Ethan Clow on January 25, 2012

Radio Freethinker Episode 150 – Scorpions are big eye balls, Andrew Wakefield Strikes Back, Pro-Piracy Group a Religion, And Is Skepticism too Paternalistic?

Download the episode here!

Skeptical News:

Scorpions Can See with their Bodies

Andrew Wakefield Sues BMJ for claiming he’s a fraud

Pro-Piracy Group Says It’s Now A Recognized Religion In Sweden

Topics:

Is skepticism too paternalistic?

Skeptical Highlights

Fracking…its import and you should be informed
http://www.propublica.org/series/fracking
http://www.propublica.org/article/oh-canadas-become-a-home-for-record-fracking

Posted in Show notes | Leave a Comment »

The Great Time Debate

Posted by Ethan Clow on January 16, 2012

Last week on the show we discussed time travel. I’ve always been rather fascinated with the concept of time travel. Where would you go? What would you do? And how would your time travel work? Would it be a car that’s been technologically enhanced? Perhaps an alien space ship that’s bigger on the inside than the outside? Or maybe you’d just fly a ship around the sun really fast?

“Were we able to navigate time as easily as we navigate space, our worldview would not just change, it would undergo the single most dramatic shift in the history of our species.” – Brian Green on Time Travel.

These are obviously questions that really can’t be answered. We can’t travel through time and its possible that time travel is simply against the laws of physics and can’t happen in our universe. So asking questions about time travel are sort of like debating what would happen if aliens existed. Not because aliens existing is a logical impossibility, but because since we only have a reference point of one (Earth) it’s really hard to theorize what aliens might be like.

There is no denying that the idea of time travel fascinates us humans. Modern science fiction is littered with stories of time travel. Everything from Back to the Future, the Terminator films, Doctor Who, Star Trek, and many others have used time travel to tell some pretty amazing stories.

And going further back in time…no pun intended, we have HG Well’s the Time Machine, Mark Twain’s A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur’s Court, and even Charles Dickens’ A Christmas Carol.

And there are even references in ancient literature to characters traveling throughout time. This idea has clearly been with us for a long time.

But okay, that’s fiction. Is time travel possible? The answer seems to be “well….maybe….”

Stephen Hawking once suggested that the absence of tourists from the future is an argument against the existence of time travel.

According to General Relativity, time travel (of a sort) is possible. You just need to go at the speed of light and time from your perspective will remain the same, but time from some other perspective will progress. So if you went near the speed of light for a day, 1000 years will have passed on the earth. This isn’t quite the same as hopping in the Tardis and jumping ahead 1000 years. Going at or near the speed of light seems pretty much impractical for humans.

What about wormholes?

So imagine a tunnel in space-time that allows you connect two different points that are normally very far apart, but via the wormhole, only a short distance away. Could this in theory allow for time travel? Well not so fast. First, we’ve (and by ‘we’ I mean scientists) have never seen a wormhole, but general relativity doesn’t rule them out either. In order for time travel to occur, you would need the entrance of the wormhole to be progressing at one time while the exit is progressing at another speed. In actuality, it’s more like time-dilation.

Now time-dilation isn’t really what we mean by time travel. Most of us imagine that time travel essentially means the traveler steps “outside” of time and re-enters at a different space in time. For example I would step outside of 2012 and step back in at 1812. Time-dilation is where I would observe time passing at a certain speed (from my perspective) but someone at a different perspective would observe time passing at a different rate. So in theory I could experience time passing normally, but from someone else’s perspective time is passing much much slower.

Of course if the wormhole was actually connecting you to a different point in time or some other universe, that would change the rules slightly.

The problem with much of these ideas and theories is that; well, ideas and theories are one thing but practical testing is next to impossible. It seems that physics would say that travel to the future is conceivable. Travel to the past…well this is still a difficult question and most likely, will remain so until the singularity.

But like I said, when have we let physics get in the way of good conversation?

First, where would you go? – The past or the Future?

What would you do there? – Vacation? Sight see? or would you attempt to alter the cause and effect of time?

Would you say, go back in time and kill Hitler? Would you go to the future and see the winning lottery numbers and then come back to the present to win the lottery?

Would the risk of creating a universe ending paradox concern or limit your time travel? Consider for a moment you go back in time to see a famous historical event, return home only to discover you’ve accidently change history and now must keep going back in time to fix things only to change the timeline even more?

What about minor things? Would you go back in time and stop yourself from eating that shellfish that made you sick? or help yourself from failing that exam? Would you take the opportunity to right old wrongs or would you rather keep them, even if they are/were painful moments in your life?

What sort of time travel would you envision? We have many examples from fiction and a few ideas from science…

Given that my chosen field of study is history, it shouldn’t be a surprise that I would go to the past. I’m not sure exactly what I would do there. Probably take in some sights and answer some old questions. I would like to know how the Pyramids were built. Same with Stonehenge. I would also like to visit Shakespeare’s globe and take in a play or two.

I guess I would be like a time traveling tourist. I’d go visit the Hanging Gardens of Babylon, I’d like to try to figure out if the Clovis people were the first to colonize North America…

I don’t know if I would change history. I would certainly be tempted too. I guess it would depend on if I could undo my changes after the fact. As much as I’d like to right history’s wrongs, I think a certain argument can be made that learning from our past failures was and is an important step in our evolution as sentient beings.

The question of the dangers of time travel seem to be very convincing. Suppose I go back in time to see the Hanging Gardens and upon returning I discover I had inadvertently set off a chain reaction that resulted in the Nazis winning world war 2. I think at that point I’d just go back and kill Hitler… But nevertheless, time travel does suggest a certain amount of risk. Of course, so does space travel. Risk is part of the deal I suppose. And where would we be if we always turned away from something because of risk?

Now since time travel differs so much in our popular media, we should consider some of the ways time travel has been imagined.

1. There is a single fixed history, which is self-consistent and unchangeable. In this version, everything happens on a single timeline which does not contradict itself and cannot interact with anything potentially existing outside of it. Any actions taken by a time traveler were part of history all along, (so if you go back and kill Hitler, you’re not creating a paradox because, in essence, you were meant to kill Hitler.) Thus it’s impossible for the time traveler to “change” history in any way. The time traveler’s actions may be the cause of events in their own past though, which leads to the potential for circular causation and the predestination paradox; where the time traveler creates the event that caused them to travel in time…

There’s also the trend where history is fixed and depending on the creativity of the writer, something prevents the time traveler from interacting with the past…  a strange law of physics, or where the traveler is rendered a non-corporeal phantom unable to physically interact with the past

Or

2. History is flexible and is subject to change (Plastic Time)

Examples include Doctor Who and the Back to the Future trilogy. In some cases, any resulting paradoxes can be devastating, threatening the very existence of the universe. The extreme version of this (Chaotic Time) is that history is very sensitive to changes with even small changes having large impacts, i.e swatting a fly in the past causes the future to change drastically.

But there is also the version of this where History is change resistant in direct relationship to the importance of the event ie. small trivial events can be readily changed but large ones take great effort or simply cannot be changed or else they destroy the universe or something. Doctor Who seems to follow this line of thought.

In the Doctor Who episode The Waters of Mars, Captain Adelaide Brooke’s death on Mars is the most singular catalyst of human travel outside the solar system. At first, the Doctor realizes her death is a “fixed point in time” and does not intervene, but later defies this rule and transports her and her crew to Earth. Rather than allow human history to change, Captain Brooke commits suicide on Earth, leaving history mostly unchanged.

Or

3. Alternate timelines. In this version of time travel, there are multiple coexisting alternate histories, so that when the traveler goes back in time, he/she ends up in a new timeline where historical events can differ from the timeline he/she came from, but her original timeline does not cease to exist (this means the grandfather paradox can be avoided since even if the time traveler’s grandfather is killed at a young age in the new timeline, he still survived to have children in the original timeline, so there is still a causal explanation for the traveler’s existence). Time travel may actually create a new timeline that diverges from the original timeline at the moment the time traveler appears in the past.

One could think of this as if “of all the possibilities (say me having Jello or ice cream) instead of me choosing ice cream and that becoming the true “fixed historical event” in reality, both choices exist in seperate timelines. One where I take the ice cream and one where I take the Jello.

In the Star Trek The Next Generation episode “Parallels” had an example of what Data called “quantum realities.” His exact words on the matter were “But there is a theory in quantum physics that all possibilities that can happen do happen in alternate quantum realities,” suggesting the writers were thinking of the many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics.

I wish I had some concrete advice to end on, like if you ever travel back in time, don’t touch anything, even the slightest change could affect the future in ways you couldn’t possibly imagine. But, given the vast differences in opinion on what sort of time line we have, how time travel would work and also, how often do you get to travel in time?

Basically, use your best judgement. If you decide to change history use your critical thinking skills first and rationally weigh the consequences of your actions.

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